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	<title>Comments on: ADA&#8217;s Kahn Responds. Speaking for Whom?</title>
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	<description>A gold mine of straight talk and encouragement for people living with diabetes</description>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://www.diabetesmine.com/2007/11/adas-kahn-respo.html/comment-page-2#comment-39232</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 16:26:10 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I am a type 2, not on insulin.  I certainly have no idea what type 1s go through, but I imagine it must be difficult to manage.  I agree they shouldn&#039;t be lumping type 1 &amp; type 2 together.  They may be the same end condition, but result from two different causes.

As for studies showing that monitoring doesn&#039;t benefit type 2s, it was just a matter of collecting data.  If you just collect data and do nothing with it, it won&#039;t help.  The monitoring is NOT the problem, but failure to act on the the data.

I have consistently kept my A1C under 6% with minimal meds.  By monitoring how different foods affect my blood sugar, I&#039;ve discovered what I can eat and how much.  One day I hope to get off my meds.  In my interaction with other diabetics, I&#039;ve discovered that foods affect people differently.  What jacks up my blood sugar, may not jack up someone elses.  The only way to know is to test and then act on what the data shows.

Of course, I&#039;ve ditched the ADA diet since I&#039;ve discovered it&#039;s a guarentee of high blood sugar.  The ADA just wants type 2s to blindly follow its diet and take their meds.  With no monitoring, no one will know that the ADA approach isn&#039;t working until they end up with nasty complications.  The ADA lost all credibility with me a long time ago.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am a type 2, not on insulin.  I certainly have no idea what type 1s go through, but I imagine it must be difficult to manage.  I agree they shouldn&#8217;t be lumping type 1 &#038; type 2 together.  They may be the same end condition, but result from two different causes.</p>
<p>As for studies showing that monitoring doesn&#8217;t benefit type 2s, it was just a matter of collecting data.  If you just collect data and do nothing with it, it won&#8217;t help.  The monitoring is NOT the problem, but failure to act on the the data.</p>
<p>I have consistently kept my A1C under 6% with minimal meds.  By monitoring how different foods affect my blood sugar, I&#8217;ve discovered what I can eat and how much.  One day I hope to get off my meds.  In my interaction with other diabetics, I&#8217;ve discovered that foods affect people differently.  What jacks up my blood sugar, may not jack up someone elses.  The only way to know is to test and then act on what the data shows.</p>
<p>Of course, I&#8217;ve ditched the ADA diet since I&#8217;ve discovered it&#8217;s a guarentee of high blood sugar.  The ADA just wants type 2s to blindly follow its diet and take their meds.  With no monitoring, no one will know that the ADA approach isn&#8217;t working until they end up with nasty complications.  The ADA lost all credibility with me a long time ago.</p>
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		<title>By: Bennet</title>
		<link>http://www.diabetesmine.com/2007/11/adas-kahn-respo.html/comment-page-2#comment-39231</link>
		<dc:creator>Bennet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 00:08:18 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I don&#039;t know who this guy is speaking for but in 06 ADA payed him  just shy of a half million in compensation and benefits.

What does ADA rank and file members for - they got him?

Page 70

&lt;a target=&quot;_blank&quot; href=&quot;http://www.diabetes.org/uedocuments/2006_990.pdf&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.diabetes.org/uedocuments/2006_990.pdf&lt;/a&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know who this guy is speaking for but in 06 ADA payed him  just shy of a half million in compensation and benefits.</p>
<p>What does ADA rank and file members for &#8211; they got him?</p>
<p>Page 70</p>
<p><a target="_blank" href="http://www.diabetes.org/uedocuments/2006_990.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.diabetes.org/uedocuments/2006_990.pdf</a></p>
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		<title>By: Amylia</title>
		<link>http://www.diabetesmine.com/2007/11/adas-kahn-respo.html/comment-page-2#comment-39230</link>
		<dc:creator>Amylia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Nov 2007 02:04:43 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Thank you, Amy, for posting this.  As a type 1 diabetic since childhood (for 19 years), I can&#039;t  believe this man in any way represents an advocate for diabetics. What a crock. I am so angry at Kahn and the Halle Berry&#039;s of the world, people who should be fighting the good fight along with us instead of muddying the waters with rhetoric and bullshite.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you, Amy, for posting this.  As a type 1 diabetic since childhood (for 19 years), I can&#8217;t  believe this man in any way represents an advocate for diabetics. What a crock. I am so angry at Kahn and the Halle Berry&#8217;s of the world, people who should be fighting the good fight along with us instead of muddying the waters with rhetoric and bullshite.</p>
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		<title>By: Lili</title>
		<link>http://www.diabetesmine.com/2007/11/adas-kahn-respo.html/comment-page-2#comment-39229</link>
		<dc:creator>Lili</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Nov 2007 17:57:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://diabetesmine.dreamhosters.com/2007/11/07/adas-kahn-responds-speaking-for-whom/#comment-39229</guid>
		<description>Sarah, I don&#039;t believe these studies that show testing made little difference for Type 2s. As far as I can tell, they just told them to test...not what to do with the information. Well, of course they need to know that to get any information, so I wasn&#039;t surprised by the results. What I have seen is testing work for Type 2s who knew what to do, again and again.

I&#039;m not sure you said the speech was not about Type 1 with regard to technology, but if you did, I encourage you to write to him and say that. He will assure you that it was about Type 1.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sarah, I don&#8217;t believe these studies that show testing made little difference for Type 2s. As far as I can tell, they just told them to test&#8230;not what to do with the information. Well, of course they need to know that to get any information, so I wasn&#8217;t surprised by the results. What I have seen is testing work for Type 2s who knew what to do, again and again.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not sure you said the speech was not about Type 1 with regard to technology, but if you did, I encourage you to write to him and say that. He will assure you that it was about Type 1.</p>
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		<title>By: Sarah</title>
		<link>http://www.diabetesmine.com/2007/11/adas-kahn-respo.html/comment-page-1#comment-39228</link>
		<dc:creator>Sarah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Nov 2007 19:57:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://diabetesmine.dreamhosters.com/2007/11/07/adas-kahn-responds-speaking-for-whom/#comment-39228</guid>
		<description>I DO NOT consider the ADA meal plan appropriate for Type 2 diabetics. But I think any diabetic with half a brain can see that, and would never follow it in the first place. It is a crime that the ADA states that T2 is a progressive disease. Of course it is when you follow the diet they suggest.

T2 diabetics (in general) should be on low carb, low glycemic, low bad fats, and high fibre diets, which will automatically go a long way to keep their blood sugars stable. They should avoid all junk, processed, high fat, high glycemic, and high carb foods. I personally have never met a T2 not on insulin with severe swings in blood sugar. Most of the time, they stay fairly close to slightly above normal range, unless they eat something they shouldn&#039;t, are stressed, or are ill. For the last two categories at least, it is true that testing is very important.

The fact is, the *vast majority* of T2&#039;s gain very little from testing overall once they have made the proper lifestyle choices. I&#039;ve read an article stating that one T2 knew to cut out his favorite candy snack after testing his blood sugar only to find it made his blood sugar shoot up. DOH! I mean if some people really ARE that dumb, OK. Give them a tester. But perhaps we should educate people to avoid those high glycemic foods 100% to both prevent and treat T2 diabetes in the first place.

It&#039;s not that I think T2&#039;s not on insulin should never test (of course not), but it is true that studies have shown that for most T2&#039;s not on insulin, testing makes little difference on a daily basis. The exception to this would be adjusting meds for weight loss, exercise, illness, etc.

Sure maybe 20% of Type 2&#039;s (including misdiagnosed LADA&#039;s, MODY&#039;s, thin and very active people with genetic insulin resistance, people who take steroids and other meds, those with other medical conditions,  etc.)*should* test daily. But the point is that for the T2 diabetes epidemic as a whole, technology is NOT the answer.




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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I DO NOT consider the ADA meal plan appropriate for Type 2 diabetics. But I think any diabetic with half a brain can see that, and would never follow it in the first place. It is a crime that the ADA states that T2 is a progressive disease. Of course it is when you follow the diet they suggest.</p>
<p>T2 diabetics (in general) should be on low carb, low glycemic, low bad fats, and high fibre diets, which will automatically go a long way to keep their blood sugars stable. They should avoid all junk, processed, high fat, high glycemic, and high carb foods. I personally have never met a T2 not on insulin with severe swings in blood sugar. Most of the time, they stay fairly close to slightly above normal range, unless they eat something they shouldn&#8217;t, are stressed, or are ill. For the last two categories at least, it is true that testing is very important.</p>
<p>The fact is, the *vast majority* of T2&#8217;s gain very little from testing overall once they have made the proper lifestyle choices. I&#8217;ve read an article stating that one T2 knew to cut out his favorite candy snack after testing his blood sugar only to find it made his blood sugar shoot up. DOH! I mean if some people really ARE that dumb, OK. Give them a tester. But perhaps we should educate people to avoid those high glycemic foods 100% to both prevent and treat T2 diabetes in the first place.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s not that I think T2&#8217;s not on insulin should never test (of course not), but it is true that studies have shown that for most T2&#8217;s not on insulin, testing makes little difference on a daily basis. The exception to this would be adjusting meds for weight loss, exercise, illness, etc.</p>
<p>Sure maybe 20% of Type 2&#8217;s (including misdiagnosed LADA&#8217;s, MODY&#8217;s, thin and very active people with genetic insulin resistance, people who take steroids and other meds, those with other medical conditions,  etc.)*should* test daily. But the point is that for the T2 diabetes epidemic as a whole, technology is NOT the answer.</p>
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		<title>By: AmyT</title>
		<link>http://www.diabetesmine.com/2007/11/adas-kahn-respo.html/comment-page-1#comment-39227</link>
		<dc:creator>AmyT</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Nov 2007 18:24:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://diabetesmine.dreamhosters.com/2007/11/07/adas-kahn-responds-speaking-for-whom/#comment-39227</guid>
		<description>Thank you, Karen.
I did wonder why Dr. Kahn was so defensive, rather than trying to help the community make some sense of his speech.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you, Karen.<br />
I did wonder why Dr. Kahn was so defensive, rather than trying to help the community make some sense of his speech.</p>
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		<title>By: Karen</title>
		<link>http://www.diabetesmine.com/2007/11/adas-kahn-respo.html/comment-page-1#comment-39226</link>
		<dc:creator>Karen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Nov 2007 16:36:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://diabetesmine.dreamhosters.com/2007/11/07/adas-kahn-responds-speaking-for-whom/#comment-39226</guid>
		<description>Amy...dear Amy...can you tell me the POINT of his e-mail? Does he consider that &quot;Damage Control&quot;? I wonder...after a few days to think about it, if he realizes he just messed up BIG time. In my eyes the e-mail he sent you was WORSE than his speech. What a jerk. I hope he reads this comment b/c he needs to go to the ADA board and read what people are saying about him...NOT GOOD. Sorry Dr.Khan, but if you hear the words &quot;YOUR FIRED&quot; in the next few weeks do not be surprised. But hey...at lesat you don&#039;t have diabetes!
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amy&#8230;dear Amy&#8230;can you tell me the POINT of his e-mail? Does he consider that &#8220;Damage Control&#8221;? I wonder&#8230;after a few days to think about it, if he realizes he just messed up BIG time. In my eyes the e-mail he sent you was WORSE than his speech. What a jerk. I hope he reads this comment b/c he needs to go to the ADA board and read what people are saying about him&#8230;NOT GOOD. Sorry Dr.Khan, but if you hear the words &#8220;YOUR FIRED&#8221; in the next few weeks do not be surprised. But hey&#8230;at lesat you don&#8217;t have diabetes!</p>
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		<title>By: camille johnson</title>
		<link>http://www.diabetesmine.com/2007/11/adas-kahn-respo.html/comment-page-1#comment-39225</link>
		<dc:creator>camille johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Nov 2007 15:01:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://diabetesmine.dreamhosters.com/2007/11/07/adas-kahn-responds-speaking-for-whom/#comment-39225</guid>
		<description>Another comment:

It seems that Doctors, Diabetic Educators, et al, are ONLY &quot;educated&quot; by pharmaceutical companies and insurance companies. AND they seem to eat it up, thinking that &quot;now&quot; they know how to treat their patients better. Bah! Humbug!
Solution: Let&#039;s develop a 5 or 7 point laminated list to distribute to EVERY medical person everywhere. The list would teach them how to question the &quot;reps&quot; that come to visit them on a daily basis. It would teach them to be cynical. It might go something like this:

To ALL medical personnel:

QUESTIONS TO ASK YOUR PHARMA REP WHEN THEY VISIT YOU:
1. How much does this cost the patient (assuming there is no insurance) per day / per month / per year?
2. Never let the rep. talk like every patient has good insurance, or any insurance at all.
3. Write their answers down on paper. Make a simple chart so they can see that you understand the real cost.
4. How many patients (T1? T2?) will WANT this product? Translation: How many patients feel this product will help control their diabetes. No, the pharma cos aren’t the best people to ask but believe me, they’ve done their research and the numbers will astound you (any maybe the rep).
5. If they don’t have the answers, show them the door and tell them to find the answers and don’t return until they have the answers. Also, tell them you will not be prescribing ANY of their products until they give you answers!
6. Verify their answers with real Diabetic patients. Use your own patients.

KEEP THIS LIST TAPED TO YOUR WALL WHERE YOU CAN SEE IT AT ALL TIMES, AND USE IT. DON’T BE INTIMIDATED BY PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES.

The cost to do this, though great, is minimal compared to the potential benefit. And don&#039;t cope out by making it sound &#039;nicer&#039;, or sending it out in some throw-away mailing, or worse, a non-read email. It has to be a &#039;keeper&#039;. Hard plastic. Colorful. Small enough to fit on a desktop but big enough to see from 6 feet.

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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another comment:</p>
<p>It seems that Doctors, Diabetic Educators, et al, are ONLY &#8220;educated&#8221; by pharmaceutical companies and insurance companies. AND they seem to eat it up, thinking that &#8220;now&#8221; they know how to treat their patients better. Bah! Humbug!<br />
Solution: Let&#8217;s develop a 5 or 7 point laminated list to distribute to EVERY medical person everywhere. The list would teach them how to question the &#8220;reps&#8221; that come to visit them on a daily basis. It would teach them to be cynical. It might go something like this:</p>
<p>To ALL medical personnel:</p>
<p>QUESTIONS TO ASK YOUR PHARMA REP WHEN THEY VISIT YOU:<br />
1. How much does this cost the patient (assuming there is no insurance) per day / per month / per year?<br />
2. Never let the rep. talk like every patient has good insurance, or any insurance at all.<br />
3. Write their answers down on paper. Make a simple chart so they can see that you understand the real cost.<br />
4. How many patients (T1? T2?) will WANT this product? Translation: How many patients feel this product will help control their diabetes. No, the pharma cos aren’t the best people to ask but believe me, they’ve done their research and the numbers will astound you (any maybe the rep).<br />
5. If they don’t have the answers, show them the door and tell them to find the answers and don’t return until they have the answers. Also, tell them you will not be prescribing ANY of their products until they give you answers!<br />
6. Verify their answers with real Diabetic patients. Use your own patients.</p>
<p>KEEP THIS LIST TAPED TO YOUR WALL WHERE YOU CAN SEE IT AT ALL TIMES, AND USE IT. DON’T BE INTIMIDATED BY PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES.</p>
<p>The cost to do this, though great, is minimal compared to the potential benefit. And don&#8217;t cope out by making it sound &#8216;nicer&#8217;, or sending it out in some throw-away mailing, or worse, a non-read email. It has to be a &#8216;keeper&#8217;. Hard plastic. Colorful. Small enough to fit on a desktop but big enough to see from 6 feet.</p>
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		<title>By: camille johnson</title>
		<link>http://www.diabetesmine.com/2007/11/adas-kahn-respo.html/comment-page-1#comment-39224</link>
		<dc:creator>camille johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Nov 2007 14:20:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://diabetesmine.dreamhosters.com/2007/11/07/adas-kahn-responds-speaking-for-whom/#comment-39224</guid>
		<description>As a T1 since 1982 (25 years) I quickly became convinced that the pharma companies ONLY wanted to &quot;invent&quot; technology that could make them richer and richer. For example, back in 1982, test strips were made of paper and could be cut in half to go twice as far. The companies QUICKLY invented plastic strips that could not be cut. Hmmm. Coincidence? I don&#039;t think so.

AND the insurance companies ALWAYS lag in accepting new technology so they don&#039;t have to pay for it. I&#039;ve been waiting for a continuous glucose monitor for 20 years (and I&#039;m sure the technology was out there) but it&#039;s only been available for a year or two. Now, the 7-day Dexcom is available but still considered (by my insurance) as experimental. Why? Because, obviously, the 3-day require twice as many replaceable parts (at $125 a shot) as the 7-day. And, is $125 even remotely related to reality? Yes, I want the pharmaceutical companies to make some profit but this is GOUGING and Greed. GREED. GREED!

Question: Surly, there must be some department in government (paid to protect citizen rights) that looks out for us. And fights for us. If the insurance syndicate and the pharmaceutical syndicate are the sole influence on capital hill, then where are the consumer advocate group?

For the record, this are my list of things that piss me off about the diabetic industry (read: suppliers and insurance; an unholy alliance if there ever was one):
1. cost of test strips
2. non-availability of generic insulin
3. lag in development/availability of CMG
4. influence of pharma cos on law/policy
5. influence of insurance cos on law/policy
6. lack of influence by T1 diabetic citizens on law/policy


</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a T1 since 1982 (25 years) I quickly became convinced that the pharma companies ONLY wanted to &#8220;invent&#8221; technology that could make them richer and richer. For example, back in 1982, test strips were made of paper and could be cut in half to go twice as far. The companies QUICKLY invented plastic strips that could not be cut. Hmmm. Coincidence? I don&#8217;t think so.</p>
<p>AND the insurance companies ALWAYS lag in accepting new technology so they don&#8217;t have to pay for it. I&#8217;ve been waiting for a continuous glucose monitor for 20 years (and I&#8217;m sure the technology was out there) but it&#8217;s only been available for a year or two. Now, the 7-day Dexcom is available but still considered (by my insurance) as experimental. Why? Because, obviously, the 3-day require twice as many replaceable parts (at $125 a shot) as the 7-day. And, is $125 even remotely related to reality? Yes, I want the pharmaceutical companies to make some profit but this is GOUGING and Greed. GREED. GREED!</p>
<p>Question: Surly, there must be some department in government (paid to protect citizen rights) that looks out for us. And fights for us. If the insurance syndicate and the pharmaceutical syndicate are the sole influence on capital hill, then where are the consumer advocate group?</p>
<p>For the record, this are my list of things that piss me off about the diabetic industry (read: suppliers and insurance; an unholy alliance if there ever was one):<br />
1. cost of test strips<br />
2. non-availability of generic insulin<br />
3. lag in development/availability of CMG<br />
4. influence of pharma cos on law/policy<br />
5. influence of insurance cos on law/policy<br />
6. lack of influence by T1 diabetic citizens on law/policy</p>
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		<title>By: Jim</title>
		<link>http://www.diabetesmine.com/2007/11/adas-kahn-respo.html/comment-page-1#comment-39223</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Nov 2007 08:24:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://diabetesmine.dreamhosters.com/2007/11/07/adas-kahn-responds-speaking-for-whom/#comment-39223</guid>
		<description>Sarah said:
Why would a T2 need to test to see that his blood sugar is just above normal range? Or that it is high, tied back to the large amount of carbs he ate for lunch. If he would just follow his meal plan, he wouldn&#039;t be high, and he would need to waste a strip to confirm that.

--------------
Individuals react differently to the same foods r.e. blood sugar levels.

Exactly what &quot;meal plan&quot; would you recommend for an older T2 woman who exercises very little and a younger woman training to run a marathon? Or a business professional who works 8-10 hours per day and exercises 45 min, 3 times per week? Or a mail delivery person who walks all day every day for her job?

Hopefully you don&#039;t mean the useless plans put out by the ADA, do you?

Sorry, Sarah, there is no way a T2 can &quot;know&quot; what his/her blood sugar is unless they test, and test often.

Tight control is the ONLY approach a T2 can reasonably rely upon to avoid the complications that come with diabetes.

That&#039;s just the reality of it.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sarah said:<br />
Why would a T2 need to test to see that his blood sugar is just above normal range? Or that it is high, tied back to the large amount of carbs he ate for lunch. If he would just follow his meal plan, he wouldn&#8217;t be high, and he would need to waste a strip to confirm that.</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
Individuals react differently to the same foods r.e. blood sugar levels.</p>
<p>Exactly what &#8220;meal plan&#8221; would you recommend for an older T2 woman who exercises very little and a younger woman training to run a marathon? Or a business professional who works 8-10 hours per day and exercises 45 min, 3 times per week? Or a mail delivery person who walks all day every day for her job?</p>
<p>Hopefully you don&#8217;t mean the useless plans put out by the ADA, do you?</p>
<p>Sorry, Sarah, there is no way a T2 can &#8220;know&#8221; what his/her blood sugar is unless they test, and test often.</p>
<p>Tight control is the ONLY approach a T2 can reasonably rely upon to avoid the complications that come with diabetes.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s just the reality of it.</p>
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